By PappyRod |

It took me a long time to find this marriage record in the middle of the Baptism records.
Now, can someone please help me determine the names of their parents?

https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.3.1/TH-267-11824-50852-3?cc=1502404&w…

Hernando, natural de mer...co (abv.?)con Juana Macias, natural de los gallos (sp?)
hija de Felipe Macias, etc.

Thank you in advance,
Roy

Bill Figueroa

11 years 11 months ago

Permalink

Roy,

The marriage record reads as follows:

"Hernando de Torres Espitia con Juana Macias"

"En 11 de enero de 615 años desposó el Padre Juan de Estrada,
Cura y Vicario de esta Villa, a Hernando de Torres Espitia,
natural de México, con Juana Macías natural de Los Gallos,
hija de Felipe Macías, premisas las solemnidades, sien-
do testigos Alonso Peguero y Francisco Macías. Velolos
el Padre Lorenzo Rodríguez de la Vera en Los Gallos a 17 de
septiembre de 1619 años. Padrinos Gaspar Macías
y Mariana de Torres, vecinos de Los Gallos. [firma] Lorenzo Rodríguez."

Only Juana's father Felipe Macías is mentioned in this record. The area known as Los Gallos is just about 15 miles SSE of the city of Aguascalientes, in Jalisco (Cerro de Los Gallos).

Rgds,

BILL FIGUEROA

----- Original Message -----
From: rvr_jr@msn.com
To: research@lists.nuestrosranchos.org
Sent: Friday, June 07, 2013 10:21 AM
Subject: [Nuestros Ranchos] Marriage record: Hernando de Torres Espitia conJuana Macias - 11 Jan 1615

It took me a long time to find this marriage record in the middle of the Baptism records.
Now, can someone please help me determine the names of their parents?

https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.3.1/TH-267-11824-50852-3?cc=1502404&w…

Hernando, natural de mer...co (abv.?)con Juana Macias, natural de los gallos (sp?)
hija de Felipe Macias, etc.

Thank you in advance,
Roy

Bill,
Thanks very much...
I was afraid that was all I was going to determine.
Roy

> From: bill_figueroa@usa.net
> To: research@nuestrosranchos.org
> Date: Fri, 7 Jun 2013 23:04:32 -0500
> Subject: Re: [Nuestros Ranchos] Marriage record: Hernando de Torres Espitia conJuana Macias - 11 Jan 1615
>
> Roy,
>
> The marriage record reads as follows:
>
> "Hernando de Torres Espitia con Juana Macias"
>
> "En 11 de enero de 615 años desposó el Padre Juan de Estrada,
> Cura y Vicario de esta Villa, a Hernando de Torres Espitia,
> natural de México, con Juana Macías natural de Los Gallos,
> hija de Felipe Macías, premisas las solemnidades, sien-
> do testigos Alonso Peguero y Francisco Macías. Velolos
> el Padre Lorenzo Rodríguez de la Vera en Los Gallos a 17 de
> septiembre de 1619 años. Padrinos Gaspar Macías
> y Mariana de Torres, vecinos de Los Gallos. [firma] Lorenzo Rodríguez."
>
> Only Juana's father Felipe Macías is mentioned in this record. The area known as Los Gallos is just about 15 miles SSE of the city of Aguascalientes, in Jalisco (Cerro de Los Gallos).
>
> Rgds,
>
> BILL FIGUEROA
>
>
>
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: rvr_jr@msn.com
> To: research@lists.nuestrosranchos.org
> Sent: Friday, June 07, 2013 10:21 AM
> Subject: [Nuestros Ranchos] Marriage record: Hernando de Torres Espitia conJuana Macias - 11 Jan 1615
>
>
> It took me a long time to find this marriage record in the middle of the Baptism records.
> Now, can someone please help me determine the names of their parents?
>
> https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.3.1/TH-267-11824-50852-3?cc=1502404&w…
>
> Hernando, natural de mer...co (abv.?)con Juana Macias, natural de los gallos (sp?)
> hija de Felipe Macias, etc.
>
> Thank you in advance,
> Roy
>
>
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Felipe Macias had also a son named Juan Macias who married Ana Mendez (daughter of Baltzar Gamboa and Ana Mendez) on April 2, 1619 in Aguascalientes. Similar to the marriage of his daughter, Felipe is only mentioned as the parent of the groom. Witnesses included Lope Ruiz de Esparza and Alonso Macias. By the way, Los Gallos was the property where the Macias Valades originally settled, not far from El Sauz de los Macias, located in the vicinity of Encarnacion de Diaz.

Jaime

Roy,
Regarding your question of who are the parents or the spouse of Felipe Macias (I), it is a question I've tried to answer for a while. The timeline of the marriages of his son Juan (1619) and his daughter Juana (1615) suggests that they were born around 1595. Note that these marriages coincide with the marriage of Felipe Macias (II) the son of Alonso Macias and Maria Vazquez de Retamosa, to Maria Tavera (1518). Although we do not have information on the birthdates of the children of Alonso and Maria,using the timeline of their marriages of the Macias-Retamosa children, we can assume they were born between 1580-1595. If Felipe was among the oldest of these children, lets say born in the early 1580's, it is possible that he could have fathered both Juan and Juana in the late 1590's, perhaps out of wedlock, later marrying Maria Tavera when he was about 40. However, another more likely explanation is that Felipe (I) was an uncle of Felipe (II).

Jaime

I have concluded that it was the Felipe Macías that married María Tavera
that was the father of Juana Vázquez Macías. See my post at
http://www.nuestrosranchos.org/es/node/21576

On Mon, Jun 10, 2013 at 9:11 PM, Jaime R. Alvarado wrote:

> Roy,
> Regarding your question of who are the parents or the spouse of Felipe
> Macias (I), it is a question I've tried to answer for a while. The timeline
> of the marriages of his son Juan (1619) and his daughter Juana (1615)
> suggests that they were born around 1595. Note that these marriages
> coincide with the marriage of Felipe Macias (II) the son of Alonso Macias
> and Maria Vazquez de Retamosa, to Maria Tavera (1518). Although we do not
> have information on the birthdates of the children of Alonso and
> Maria,using the timeline of their marriages of the Macias-Retamosa
> children, we can assume they were born between 1580-1595. If Felipe was
> among the oldest of these children, lets say born in the early 1580's, it
> is possible that he could have fathered both Juan and Juana in the late
> 1590's, perhaps out of wedlock, later marrying Maria Tavera when he was
> about 40. However, another more likely explanation is that Felipe (I) was
> an uncle of Felipe (II).
>
> Jaime

Jaime:

Según los datos que conozco, "Los Gallos" debío ser parte de "Peñuelas", propiedad originalmente de Nicolás Ramirez. Supongo que despues de contraer matrimonio sus hijas con Felipe y Gaspar Macias Valades, posiblemente hayan fraccionado la propiedad tocándole a Maria de Tavera la parte sur-oriental (donde surgirían Los Gallos)y a Mariana de Torres la parte sur-occidental (donde surgiría Santa Ines del Sauz). Es solo una suposición con base en unos pocos datos. Actualmente los gallos es un rancho casi abandonado, propiedad de un señor de apellido Pedroza, casado con una prima de mi madre.

Lo que das fructifica. Lo que te guardas se pudre.
Miguel Beltran

Genealogy Research